Commenter Lookup *Caution* Unless you see an ADMIN tag, the comments below may not all belong to the same person! "The Prodigal" | View Comments2 | ArouetAug 8, 2009 Stylistically this is also a hugely important episode because it marks the first use of the juxtaposition of (usually past and present) events for the sake of reinforcing a theme. It's this episode that leads to Five by Five, Darla, and Deep Down. "Epiphany" | View Comments3 | ArouetJul 30, 2009 I think this episode is the ultimate study of the difference between importance and sheer level or quality, and whether they really have a distance. This is pretty assuredly the most important episode of the entire series, and despite the relatively low volume of drama, there are no more cathartic moments in the entire story than Angel's rescue of Kate, and of course that final conversation between Angel and Kate containing the series' most iconic quote. So the question is, if we're rating the quality of episodes taking into account how they fit into the story rather than how they hold up as standalones, shouldn't this be ranked number one? "Reunion" | View Comments4 | ArouetJul 28, 2009 You saw her pleading to Angel for help as she was dying, so it sure sounds like she invited him in. "Lullaby" | View Comments5 | ArouetJul 25, 2009 I don't think Angel's realization here that he can never redeem himself is a result of Epiphany, but an abandonment of it. During Epiphany he may have forsaken the idea that all would be made right once he had completed his destiny, but he still had hope that he could defy the evil within him by healing and helping others day after day. Whereas you note after this episode he stops acting like a "champion" and becomes concerned only with protecting his family. In other words, he tried to be like any other normal human being. For the rest of season 3 he ceases to seek redemption and is perfectly willing to do both good and evil according to his passions or his love of his family, which is similar to, but more mundane than, his fall in season 2 to some of the archetypically worse failings of humanity. But as you have explained, in your review of Guise Will Be Guise, of Angel's failure to accept that he is a mixture of Liam and Angelus, in that he considered himself as primarily a demon, I think after Lullaby he goes in the opposite direction and tries to deny his demon nature. Which is why Deep Down is so important because mirroring Epiphany, where he ceased denial of his humanity (realizing he was mistaken in believing that only a demon could commit evil), in Deep Down he ceased his attempt to be a normal human being, reembraced both sides of his identity, and took on the champion persona once more, albeit on more pessimistic terms. "The House Always Wins" | View Comments6 | ArouetJul 8, 2009 Ok, this is a bad episode, but paradoxically, it actually made me appreciate Angel more. On any other supposedly "good" series, this would be half-decent or below average. On Angel? Utterly inexcusable. It's not until you watch this and Provider that you realize how high the bar has been set. You actually have a right to be mad at a bad Angel episode, instead of saying "well that's bound ot happen sometimes." "Five by Five" | View Comments7 | ArouetJun 16, 2009 The best ten scenes of Angel (in nor particular order): Faith breaking down in Angel's arms (This episode) The entire elevator scene in Reprise "If nothing we do matters, than all that matters is what we do" (Epiphany) Darla sacrificing herself and Holtz lowering the crossbow, allowing Angel and Connor to escape (Lullaby) Darla rejecting Angel during the Boxer Rebellion juxtaposed with Angel "rejecting" Darla in the present day (Darla) Angelus murdering his family and then speaking with Darla (The Prodigal) Angel trying to kill Wesley on his hospital bed (Forgiving) Wesley and Illyria discussing how small human lives are on the roof of his apartment (Underneath) Spike vs. Puppet Angel (Smile Time) "I'm sorry, but I just can't seem to care" (Reunion) "Deep Down" | View Comments8 | ArouetJun 16, 2009 My point was only that in this review you made this episode sound more subtle than it really was, and that its lack of subtlety was its strength. And you can say all you want that you placed your own opinions upon the interpretation of Deep Down, but even if that was true, then your opinions coincided so much with what the episode was trying to argue for that your "preaching" was indistinguishable from your dead-on analysis of the new morality of Angel that dominates this season, and to a lesser extent season 5. I promise you I would have enjoyed my first gothrough of Season 4 a lot less if I hadn't read your clarifying comment "To be good is to do the right thing in spite of what you want" that gave me the framework to understand what the writers were trying to do with the whole season. You were right the first time. And I'm not trying to take you down here! I never would have bought the first two seasons on DVD if I hadn't stumbled upon this site (I'd watched Buffy but never Angel before). I see this show primarily on an intellectual level, like you, and I agree with pretty much all of your opinions except your overall reviews of Season 3 (I tend to judge whole story arcs primarily by their best moments and not their filler) and S5 (a whoooooooole 'nother story). "Ground State" | View Comments9 | ArouetJun 16, 2009 If a friend I'd been through thick and thin with tried to kill me, and then all my friends abandoned me, when I was trying to save that first friend from killing his own son, then regardless of whether I botched the rescue or not, I'd be pretty bitter. Especially if my faith in my ability to be a hero was totally obliterated, along with any confidence in the craft I had trained my whole life for, and it was all for nothing. And especially if it meant I got to sleep with Lilah. ;P "Ground State" | View Comments10 | ArouetJun 16, 2009 Good lord did the writers botch Gwen's character. Never would happened if Minear and Greenwalt had still been around. Although she thankfully gets one great scene in Players where she puts on a device that absorbs the electricity in her skin and she gets to touch and kiss someone for the first time. I actually wanted her to stay around after seeing that, but then again I'm a horrible sap. "Ground State" | View Comments11 | ArouetJun 12, 2009 You review is dead on, except you seriously underrate the scene where Fred breaks down in front of Gunn and says he died and left her all alone. IMO it establishes the burden and loneliness Fred was carrying through between S3 and S4 better than all of her scenes in Deep Down, and it took all of thirty seconds of dialogue. Plus we get to see some tenderness between Fred and Gunn that needed to be shown before Supersymmetry (and I think you horribly underrated that episode your first go through, btw. The way Gunn and Fred's decisions played out in Seidel's death scene was just brilliant characterization). And nobody cares about the house always wins. Can we please go straight to Slouching Towards Bethlehem? Pretty please? "Deep Down" | View Comments12 | ArouetJun 7, 2009 Well there's a season to be subtle and let the plot cover the ideas of the story with a bedsheet and then there's a season to be open and aggressive and passionate, and one of the reasons I loved this show so much was that it knew when to stop being subtle and gentle and just let us listen to Angel trying to struggle with the meaning of his experiences. Reprise and Epiphany made nothing BUT big sweeping statements about humanity and evil and goodness, and those two and Deep Down are IMO, the best three episodes of the entire series(cept maybe Lullaby, Darla, and The Prodigal). Sometimes it takes more courage to come out and let the characters speak when you're afraid of sounding preachy than it is to restrain yourself when you want to preach. Even if they let the characters be themselves, you can't deny that the writers were obviously using them to illustrate specific examples of different philosophies. Angel IS just. Connor IS being pragmatic to the point of having the same actions as an evil person. Wesley IS succumbing to the same logic that dominates Connor, that seeking real justice is the luxury of those who do not suffer. The fact that it is so openly a parable is precisely what makes it so great. "Deep Down" | View Comments13 | ArouetMay 23, 2009 I preferred your more optimistic analysis of this episode the first time you reviewed it, but I will admit this is very good. You don't seem to place much weight on "We live as though the world were as it should be, to show it what it can be" anymore. Now you seem to think of it as just a little cry in the vast darkness now, and not the passionate, powerful defiance that I thought it was, and you believed it was, when you wrote your first review. "Deep Down" | View Comments14 | ArouetMay 23, 2009 And while you have to give them points for bravery in the way that they spun everything that had happened before this season together, I think it was detrimental to the overall story. It cheapens Darla's sacrifice and Holtz's tragedy by arguing that it wasn't really their choice. And for all the reckless bravery of the writers during this season the way they botched Orpheus and the Angelus arc in general remains inexcusable, and possibly cowardly. "Forgiving" | View Comments15 | ArouetJan 25, 2009 It would have been so much better for Sahjahn's real motive to kill Connor to be an attempt to stop Jasmine's birth. His motives would have remained a secret until season 4 when Cordelia would either manipulate the gang or Angelus to kill him before he could come to their aid. "Forgiving" | View Comments16 | ArouetJan 25, 2009 It would have been so much better for Sahjahn's real motive to kill Connor to be an attempt to stop Jasmine's birth. His motives would have remained a secret until season 4 when Cordelia would either manipulate the gang or Angelus to kill him before he could come to their aid. "Blood Money" | View Comments18 | ArouetNov 14, 2008 Also worth a little mention is when Merl is hit by one of Lilah's thugs in his apartment and he thinks it's Angel. |
Latest News  The Shell of Despair MikeJer - Mar 17, 2013 At long last, another ACP update! Forum superstar Iguana-on-a-Stick has turned in another great review! Hit the title for the link, and enjoy. :D View Full Post Latest Comments Nic Nac [Apocalypse, Nowish] *in reply to Hera (#11) Hera, it wasn't so much the age thing for me, but the huge differen... View CommentMay 15, 2013 David [Five by Five] How did angel manage to get into the " guy who faith hospitalized" into his apartment becaus... View CommentMay 10, 2013 David [Hero] This episode was very good , I get upset everytime Doyle dies in this episode. Is it me or w... View CommentMay 10, 2013 Latest Forum Posts Brachen Man [Supernatural Rewatch] "Sin City" is criminally underrated. That was Jeremy Carver's first episode as wel... View PostMay 21, 2013 Ryan ONeil [Xander Harris] The problem with DMP isn't the argument. It's A] the party being over the top and out of cha... View PostMay 20, 2013 MikeJer [Critically Touched Reviews: Frea] w00t w00t! View PostMay 19, 2013 |
"...writing staff and main cast had burned out heavily by that time and just didn't care..."
Really? I always felt the writer's attempt to keep S4 from falling apart completely, after they failed to think the plot through well enough, to be an almost heroic effort. I mean, they made a couple of really bad decisions, but at no point did I feel they were lacking in effort.
Season 4 of Angel is the season that even though it infuriates me sometimes, and I try to hate it, I just can't. I have too much affection for it, the flawed bastard that it is. Contrast that with S5, which I tried so hard to like, but I just couldn't get over the misgivings I had with it, aside from a couple of undeniable masterpieces like Underneath.
And personally I'm a hell of a lot more bitter over the departure of Greenwalt and Minear than anything else (which might have completely ruined the series if DeKnight hadn't stepped up to the plate in a big way in their absence).